Cogmind beta 3 [SPOILER] thread

[Happylisk]

HERE THERE BE SPOILERS

This is the thread for all questions and discussions about spoilery things in the Steam release.  It goes without saying that this thread will be filled with spoilers so read at your own risk. 

You've been warned!

Here's my spoilery question.  In caves I found today an alien artifact called the Dimensional Node Initializer.  There was a terminal nearby but it's log didn't give me any ideas as to what this thing does.  I just decided to attach it, which resulted in it implanting in the ground and creating an orange tile.  I couldn't pick the tile up and stepping on it had no visible effect.

My theory is that this artifact creates a little dimensional pocket, so that when you attach it and stand on the square you're invisible to enemies.  Just a guess though.  It'll be awhile before I find this guy again, making experimentation hard, so if anyone has insight into what this little guy does i'd love to know!

[Sherlockkat]

Hey happylisk, welcome back!!!!!

Dimensional Node Initializer doesn't do anything on its own. You need to combine it with another space-wacey timey-wimey artifact. Sure you know what that is!!!

[zxc]

Well, it does have a second effect which works on its own. Let's just say it's dangerous to play around with.

[Happylisk]

Hey happylisk, welcome back!!!!!

Dimensional Node Initializer doesn't do anything on its own. You need to combine it with another space-wacey timey-wimey artifact. Sure you know what that is!!!

Hi Sherlockkat!  Thanks for the tip.  I do indeed know which artifact you're referring to, so I'll know what to do with that guy in the future.

Kyzrati: I have a friend who plays cogmind and he also found the Node a few days ago and had no clue what to do with it.  It's possible that the terminal next to the node should give a small clue, otherwise most people will probably just attach it on the spot, which seems like a waste. 

zxc:  Interesting to know that it has a secondary effect.  I'll try to figure it out.

On an unrelated note, I think the difficulty level of the warlord branch is still a pinch too high for combat builds.  I was treading and going at 55% speed - by the time I found Warlord, the attack had not only already begun, but had eliminated most of Warlord's forces and there were marksman squads about 20 paces from Warlord.   

[Kyzrati]

Kyzrati: I have a friend who plays cogmind and he also found the Node a few days ago and had no clue what to do with it.  It's possible that the terminal next to the node should give a small clue, otherwise most people will probably just attach it on the spot, which seems like a waste. 

It's meant to be a secret-ish part that the player is supposed to puzzle over what to do with it. Wasting it is fine. Even once you know what it does, it's pretty niche. Also, there is more than one way to get one--they're not always near a terminal.

On an unrelated note, I think the difficulty level of the warlord branch is still a pinch too high for combat builds.  I was treading and going at 55% speed - by the time I found Warlord, the attack had not only already begun, but had eliminated most of Warlord's forces and there were marksman squads about 20 paces from Warlord.   

Nah it's fine, if moving slow you just can't afford to do any deep exploration or even waste turns (at all, at least until you've located him). I always go in on legs or treads and always make it out, and that was back when combat propulsion was slower than it is now.

[Happylisk]

I guess I dilly dallyed too much then.  As for the Node, you might want to add to the existing log when a terminal does spawn that whatever it does is a puzzle - that'd be a hint to the player that they're dealing with something that's not straightforward. 

[DDarkray]

I had a similar problem too at Warlord where I stayed a little too long until almost everyone was gone. I think I was on legs at that time, but what helped me get through is by using a bunch of launchers. You can't afford to fight slowly.

[Kyzrati]

That's for sure. It's interesting like that, because during big fights in other parts of the complex, your best bet is to find a really defensible position, and even continue retreating as necessary, but here you absolutely have to keep pushing forward into the thick of it.

Hm.... maybe we need more of this

[Happylisk]

A thing I learned today: If you get imprinted at Zion and also meet dataminer, the holding cells in extension automatically open.  Extension is a great map for a Zionate on top of it, since all those terminals mean tons of reinforcements.

I know blowing up transfer stations reduces the size of enemy reinforcements down the road.  Does it also make programmer dispatch teams smaller?  I'm use to seeing 4ish programmers per dispatch in research, and this time it was smaller than that.

Bonus hilarity: When you're sneaking around Testing trying not to be pinpointed and corruption makes one of your weapons go off. 

[zxc]

Yeah, Extension is easier than it used to be (for those reasons).

I'm not sure transfer stations affect hostiles. It might just be neutrals.

[Happylisk]

Hmm if it's just neutral bots, that's a pretty minor perk to Extension.  It's still a fun branch though. 

[Kyzrati]

Transfer Stations are just an extra thing, not a compelling reason to visit the branch (compared to all the other reasons!), though there's lore about what they do.

[Happylisk]

Had a great run ended yet again by testing (this time indirectly).  I was stomping through Research 2 and found the exit.  Sadly it led to testing and I tried to be real careful to avoid getting scanned.  ZIon intel gave me the exit (at least testing isn't huge), but even with that I managed to get pinpointed before I could get out.  Combat programmers and Q series grunts made Access basically impossible.  Died a few steps from Command.  On the bright side, I got to wield an EMOS for the first time.  Now *that* is a weapon.

This run's discovery: blowing up mindsweepers in caves makes them drop traps.  Great way to deal with grunt squads you find in there.   

[Happylisk]

Nah it's fine, if moving slow you just can't afford to do any deep exploration or even waste turns (at all, at least until you've located him). I always go in on legs or treads and always make it out, and that was back when combat propulsion was slower than it is now.

Yeah, upon a second visit the balance is seems right.  I got there with a decent tread build today and made a point to find WL asap.  Found him (in my haste forgot to visit his stache, that was dumb), and waited until the counter attack was announced.  I fought with them, inching forward, and when there was a pause between the waves made a run for it.  Got dinged up but out more or less in one piece.  As long as you have a launcher and some spare armor it's not an ordeal. 

Too bad you can't fully explore the map on treads, it's such an interesting level.  It causes Z allies to fry - I wonder if that's the demented guys at the entrance or something special about the level. 

Also, finding the bomb maker in Zion in then dropping tons of bombs where the attack will come from is pretty fun. 

[Kyzrati]

There you go

And there is one wayare at least two ways () to fully explore it despite treads; I don't bother with it, but it's... technically possible.

Also, finding the bomb maker in Zion in then dropping tons of bombs where the attack will come from is pretty fun. 

Haha, that's great.  We'll definitely need even more unique items like that in the future!

[zxc]

If you're lucky enough to have a slip node and a teleporter... that's ideal for fully exploring W.

You can also drop your stuff in a room and fly around before coming back.

[Happylisk]

More discoveries means more questions!  I got to the hidden lab - confirmed even more of my suspicions about what's going on.  Afterwords, I began getting combat programmer dispatches.  Does that happen whenever you enter armory, or only if you enter the lab?

Was bummed to learn that being a Zionate is irreconcilable with Warlord reward.  Makes sense, you gotta pick a side.  Warlord's alternative speech made me realize it's time for me to explore Deep caves.  Is there any way to reliably enter, given that the code doesn't spawn each game?  If you have a weapon strong enough to bust the door open, would attacking it piss off Zion? 

[zxc]

That's lab related.

There are reliable ways to enter. Destroying the walls/door doesn't piss anyone off. There's also another reliable way.

[Sherlockkat]

There are reliable ways to enter. Destroying the walls/door doesn't piss anyone off. There's also another reliable way.

I think Kyzrati nerfed the wall destruction strategy where you open the door using Zh code and carve out a path along the walls avoiding the scanners. But Lab is currently borked in that just opening the door results in getting scanned 100% of the time, so best to avoid that place.

As far as I know there is only one way to get in without getting detected if you discount the wall strat.

[zxc]

We're talking about ZDC entrance.

[Happylisk]

Finally got my first win of the steam release.  The difference was I finally figured out how to manage the Research branches without wrecking myself (or guaranteeing future wreckage).  I'm also now a hardcore believer in not upgrading weapon slots and rocking two cannons supported by combat utilities.  Two enhanced nova cannons and an advanced energy filter, advanced particle charger, and advanced weapon cycler make short work of most things.  By the end most programmers were getting one shot.   Also, quantum warhead launchers are hilarious. 

I think the game's balance, including the late game branches and end game, is spot on.  Consistently difficult but doable.

Anyone know if transmission jammers prevent researchers from pinpointing you?  If the answer is no, I'd hate to find out the hard way.   

[Kyzrati]

"Two enhanced nova cannons" with any number of supporting utilities is an insanely deadly build, yes. Love those things

And congrats on your win! We'll get to see it on the leaderboards tommorrow...

[Happylisk]

And you'll get to see that I exited Access butt naked   I hacked the surface exit and planned to go around back, but I got hit simultaneously by an assault squad, an investigation squad, and a programmer dispatch right by the front door, and a third colossus spawned by the normal two!  I decided that standing and fighting was a mistake, so I switched to only defensive utilities and marched past the guards and right through the front door.  Had just enough to make it, but only got out with 180 core.... close!

[Kyzrati]

Hehe, close Access escapes are... not unheard of

[Happylisk]

That's lab related.

There are reliable ways to enter. Destroying the walls/door doesn't piss anyone off. There's also another reliable way.

Besides blowing the doors (hard at that point in the game unless you visit waste I guess and get lucky) and wanton murder, are there any other ways in?  As silly as it sounds, going full metal rampage in zion makes me sad