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[fluff12321]

Any tips for effective thermal weapon use?

Attempting a high level description of the weapon types to reveal my lack of knowledge on thermals:

• Kinetic -- pros: straightforward damage, low energy/heat requirements, effective on most enemy types, piercing; cons: matter consumption, recoil accuracy reduction, damages/destroys parts
• EM -- pros: best option for salvaging parts with minimal damage, effective against non-programmer enemies; cons: very weak vs programmers
• Explosive -- pros: efficiently clears several small/weak enemies, good option in emergencies; cons: can bring unwanted aggression, heavy matter consumption, ineffective at close range
• Melee - pros: excellent last resort if low on matter, high damage and resource efficient if you can fight at close range; cons: can't be combined with a weapon volley (opportunity cost)
• Thermal - pros: damages while heating enemies...  cons: very high energy consumption, very high heat generation, often damages and melts parts limiting salvage potential

I know thermal weapons are supposedly good, but my lack of understanding of them makes them seem somewhat like the worst. I'd like to understand how to use them most effectively so I can better appreciate their use.  Attached a screenshot of a WaveGun(.png) I happen to have equipped now. Comparing this to the KE Penetrator on the same tier:

KE Penetrator vs WaveGun
Damage: 23.5 vs 24
Energy: 2 vs 23 (both are manageable)
Matter: 4 vs 0 (yes, WaveGun wins here, but 4 matter isn't much and is rarely an issue)
Heat: +33 vs +81 (ouch)
Crit: 10% vs 0% (a notable disadvantage)
Penetration: 1x 80 vs N/A (another disadvantage)
Heat Transfer: N/A vs +37 (is this any good?)

Looking at the two side by side, the WaveGun looks far worse overall as the heat generation is going to require several utility slots dedicated to heat management to ensure you can reliably keep using the weapon in extended combat. (better hope you have access to multiple coolant injectors, or 3-4 utility slots for heat sinks). I figure I must be missing something.  Does Heat Transfer +37 mean the target heats up 37 when hit? (seems insignificant), or is it 81+37? (better, but still not good enough)    If I were fighting 1vs1 overheating the opposing robot via 81+37 heat seems a viable strategy, less so in 1v2, and much less so in 1vs3+ (often the case in Cogmind). In any of the above situations (except vs programmers), it seems EM weapons & kinetics have thermals beat hands down. Vs Programmers, thermals seem "just okay" as a way to get a bit of extra damage in a 1vs2 without consuming matter on ammo (setting aside the matter costs switching from EMs to thermals when programmers approach...)

Overall, I get the sense thermals are good, but don't understand why and feel like I'm missing out on something great in the game because of it. Appreciate any tips / suggestions on how you think about & use thermals most effectively.

[Joshua]

Thermal weapons are somewhat situational but good in many cases if you can keep up with heat and energy. They are better if you commit to them (e.g. your entire volley is thermal instead of a mix between thermal and something else). That's also true for the other weapon types.

Depending on the robot, +37 heat x2-3 can be enough to overheat them after a couple volleys: especially some of the early game bots don't even have enough cooling to keep up with their own heat from firing weapons. Overheating them gives you an advantage in that they will miss you more often and if it gets high enough you can melt them instead of having to do direct core damage.

Some of the thermal advantages they have in common with EM, because they're both energy weapons: you can use particle charges etc., and QCs. Also some tough late game enemies, and certain walls, are not resistant to thermal while they are to the other damage types: this effectively makes thermal a weakness for many enemies -- as you noted with programmers.

Thermal weapons are also, I believe, the only category that has items that can be overloaded: not a mechanic I have used much, but doubling your damage output is probably very useful in some circumstances, and Overload Amplifiers can increase it even more, to nearly triple what it would be without overloading.

Not using matter with each shot is a considerable advantage. Energy filters also provide a relatively bigger advantage to energy-based weapons.

Also, unlike EM, they don't have a chance of causing engine explosions. This could be good or bad depending on the situation but means thermal is less dangerous to use at close range. The lack of penetration also means you are less likely to shoot through a robot and damage important and/or dangerous machinery.

The in-game description text for Thermal may mention some other things. I think one is they tend as a category to have very consistent damage output, while other weapon types are more variable.

Also pay attention to the resistances for explosive machines: some are more likely to be set off by EM, others by thermal or kinetic attacks. Depending on whether or not you want explosions it can be helpful to choose your armament accordingly.

[fluff12321]

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. An all thermal volley is something I've never tried... when I consider your point that thermal weapons are 'somewhat situational' it seems like it might be difficult to build primarily around them (devoting many utility slots to heat management)... thinking about it, relatively few enemies have significant thermal resistance so perhaps I could try a primarily thermal build and see how it does.

My current run came across a friendly/neutral character named Zhirov (or something similar?) and he offered a few components which would have helped a thermal build quite a bit... I ended up leaving the items behind not having enough room for them in storage, but am curious to try them on a future run.

Thanks again.

[fluff12321]

Out of curiosity, has anyone ever tried a purely thermal build the entire run? (having a few alternatives when necessary, but relying primarily on thermals throughout?)  Wondering if it's viable.

[Kyzrati]

You could certainly use pure thermal an entire run, not that hard. In fact it can be preferable because it's not weak against any common combat bot, unlike the other damage types.

Specifically with regard to heat management, Coolant Injectors make running lots of thermal weapons easy with minimal slot use. The dissipation investment for full thermal before they were added to the game was rather high, but even with just a single injector you'll usually be fine.

[fluff12321]

Interesting! Excited to try it out -- thanks!