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Author Topic: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]  (Read 25353 times)

Shobalk

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2016, 07:08:39 PM »

Ensuring that each fab has a limited number of uses would prevent abuses.

The time constraint is also good, but it should be implemented properly. Waiting around doing nothing is boring. Instead, modify the food clock directly.

I like the limited uses idea to prevent abuse.  I also agree in principle with the destructive matter container idea, but in practice, I think that'd tick me off too ;)  I love matter containers once I actually start carrying them around. 

In matter critical situations, I call it Ghost Busting™.  Throw it on the floor and step on it to unleash the whoopass.
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #26 on: April 01, 2016, 02:36:14 AM »

I think the limited uses idea could work here, as some kind of internal limitation on the Fabricator's own supplies (probably higher for higher ratings). In most cases we have the fact that hacking already has a cap since you can no longer reset a trace, though that alone may not be enough to prevent someone really focused on hacking from getting a bit too much out of one machine.

That said, limitations kinda go further against my original hopes you could seriously build and maintain an army of robots. This discussion has mostly been revolving around parts, but robots can be built, too! However, I'm not so certain about the long-term viability of that plan, anyway, since Fabricator distribution is not guaranteed....

Anyway, the ultimate goals are to avoid grind (both the necessary and optimal kinds) while making fabrication useful, so it'll be some combination of all these, um, conflicting opinions :P

I kinda like the idea of destroying the matter storage units, and can see that working with instant fabrication pretty well.

I love matter containers once I actually start carrying them around.

In matter critical situations, I call it Ghost Busting™.  Throw it on the floor and step on it to unleash the whoopass.
Heh, I was wondering if anyone was doing that.

I tend to ignore containers for the most part, but once I have one or two, especially once full, it's hard to put it down because they're nice to have just in case.
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Happylisk

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2016, 09:00:37 AM »

Some more observations: The mines now have derelict logs.  Section 7 is a branch in Research.... and there's another mid game branch called Zion.  I have no idea what Zion is, but I suspect its a derelict city and a hat tip to the matrix.  There are Main.C garrisons in caves with special terminals that if you hack them give you nice intel about future levels.  Finally, the god mode hack that data miner gives you changes each game. 

Caves are really high risk high reward.  Going into them with an EMP AoE weapon is rough.  My runs keep ending the proximity caves right after data miner... too much attrition.

E: There's a branch in caves call Zhirov or something like that, and a branch in research called Testing which I had never seen before. 
 
« Last Edit: April 02, 2016, 11:06:17 AM by Happylisk »
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Decker

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2016, 09:58:49 AM »

I made it to the Data Miner branch again. Just as I was about to reach the terminals, a corruption misfire takes out the conduit. Of course. But I was prepared. Even though I only had 150 integrity left, I had three launchers, armor and reserve matter. They cried, they died. I still got the lore, though I think I missed the God Mode hack that Happylisk referred to. Next time I'll drop my weapons on entry.

Killing the guards appear pointless. But it looks a safe place to purge corruption, if you don't mind the grind.

By the way, in the caves, you can pick up stuff and drop it again to prevent it to melt. The scavengers aren't very aggressive, and it can come handy to have a stockpile of weapons.
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #29 on: April 05, 2016, 08:30:51 PM »

Spoiler: score (click to show/hide)

Chalk one more up for hunters :(. This one critted my power supply off slowing me down. Through a wall. The swarmers and programmers finished me off. Was so close to winning...

Is there anything hunters can't do? You run into rooms. They shoot through walls. They hit like a truck, thanks to long ranged weapons with high damage and high crits. They dodge well, coz cloaking. They are accurate over a long ranges, coz lol targeting computers. You can't see them coming via sensors due to their innate cloaking. Run from them. They send their drones after you. Jerks.

On a more serious note, speed/hack runs more or less feel the same except hunters deliver more ouchies and are even more hard to detect. I was very close to winning when the finally decided that they had enough of my bs and put an end to the whole affair.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2016, 08:32:56 PM by Sherlockkat »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #30 on: April 05, 2016, 08:48:11 PM »

Super low kill count! Quite a fast run there.

They are (once again) the deadliest of the common robots, for sure, and the ones that I most fear meeting. In addition to their other re-buffs, I did make them harder to detect without the best sensors, but you can still see them if you get the Exp. version (or use other methods like terminal tracking).

The Hunter prototypes defending the Hub are even worse :P

I wonder how they'll compare to the new Programmer model which I don't believe anyone has encountered yet--no drones or cloaking, but they're faster and pack a punch.
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Happylisk

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #31 on: April 06, 2016, 06:30:30 AM »

I recently had a run end on -4 after I encounter five (!) teams of hunters in the span of a few minutes - the last fight involved fighting 4 hunters at once.  I can't imagine the cogmind that can handle 10 hunters in a brief span of time. 

When I have a spare moment I really need to blow up data miner and see what happens.  These days I try to always have a signal interpreter when I go into the lower caves to make sure I don't miss him. 
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #32 on: April 06, 2016, 07:52:58 AM »

Once Alpha 9 is done, the difficulty of the latter floors will be a different story. The Hunters just got their upgrade first :P

Alpha 8 will also be adding some more artifacts!

My last seed run got nasty when I hit several hunters at once, too, but I can't blame it on them since they had plenty of assistance.
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #33 on: April 06, 2016, 10:25:32 PM »

Quote
I wonder how they'll compare to the new Programmer model which I don't believe anyone has encountered yet--no drones or cloaking, but they're faster and pack a punch.

Just died to the new programmers in research/-2 :). Holy crap, their weapons. I wish I was playing a combat build so that I could get my hands on them. As a speed build, I just had to settle for watching those programmers vaporize (literally!!) haulers and recylcers as I used them as cover. Didn't help though. They kept up with me and pack a lot of hurt. Well played, K.

edit : Seems like there a huge score bonus for making 'it' happen. It might be a nice way for speed builds to prop up their sad scores. Question :Do the combat progs not show up till -2? I was wondering how the game got hard until they showed up.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2016, 10:28:47 PM by Sherlockkat »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #34 on: April 06, 2016, 10:32:08 PM »

Ooh, you found them! Good thing they're completely optional since they won't show up unless you did that thing ;)

Someone wants you dead!
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #35 on: April 06, 2016, 10:38:01 PM »

Quote
Ooh, you found them! Good thing they're completely optional since they won't show up unless you did that thing ;)

Haha. The thing reminded me of this from the matrix.
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #36 on: April 06, 2016, 10:40:04 PM »

Hahahaha, exactly. There are a growing number of Matrix and Star Wars references in here.
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #37 on: April 06, 2016, 10:55:27 PM »

This may or may not be a typo. The log message says "...pinpointed LCS-V3...". Should it not be LRC-V3?
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #38 on: April 06, 2016, 11:05:40 PM »

Whoops, yes, that's a typo, thanks!

And on reviewing what you get by doing that thing, I just made another addition. I'm also thinking of having robot analyses give you a dodge bonus, too, that way it's not only combat builds that can get some benefit out of that bit.
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #39 on: April 06, 2016, 11:11:29 PM »

Yes plz. I will take another +10 to dodge incoming fire. I want to go back down there with my regular hacker build. The build I was running on my last game was fairly crappy. I had nothing but propulsion and enh optical array to carry me through. So, I was pretty much on my last "legs" when I showed up on -2. A hacky build can leverage the machine locations much more effectively.
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #40 on: April 06, 2016, 11:14:52 PM »

I think we'll start with 5%, but I'm sure you'll take that, too :P
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #41 on: April 06, 2016, 11:22:58 PM »

Quote
I think we'll start with 5%, but I'm sure you'll take that, too :P

Fine :). I knew you were going to say no to +10. Worth a try though.
Lore Q:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #42 on: April 06, 2016, 11:41:58 PM »

Oh here we go again with tags :P
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Happylisk

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #43 on: April 07, 2016, 05:43:39 AM »

Ooh, you found them! Good thing they're completely optional since they won't show up unless you did that thing ;)

Someone wants you dead!

Ooh I really want to figure out what this thing is.  I'm going to try a hack for Record(LRC-V3) at the oracle terminal.  Your matrix reference makes me believe that the Oracle is involved....

Also I love the battlestar galactica-esque overarching plot in a game otherwise filled with robots.  Poor humans :(
« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 06:44:30 AM by Happylisk »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #44 on: April 07, 2016, 05:55:53 AM »

Aw, poor humans... you'll learn a bit more about them in Alpha 8 :)
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #45 on: April 07, 2016, 06:40:11 PM »

Re spoilers : Ya. I read the records in Cetus. I don't know why I thought the Cogmind had anything to do with the revision series. Faulty memory :).
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Enno

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #46 on: April 09, 2016, 02:24:47 PM »

Sir, any informations about new hacks ?
and i saw in scoresheet that it's possible to set
trojans in every machiene !? but how ? and what kind of and so on...
will we get some informations âbout all this new stuff ? please ^____^
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #47 on: April 09, 2016, 07:00:19 PM »

Well, I've given out some of the unlisted hacks while streaming, and others you can find via the game lore (via terminals). I also gave away 10 of them in the spoiler-filled Unauthorized Hacks blog post last year. There are currently 14 unlisted hacks in the world, 4 of which you can learn in game without spoilers. Many more are coming to the lore in Alphas 8 and 9.

However, there are no Trojans for some machines (they're listed in the score sheet purely for completion's sake, since they may one day have some :P). Now that you mention it, I think I'll add a Trojan to the Recycling Unit now that it has its final behavior. In general Trojans aren't as widely applicable as brute force hacks since the former are for continuous effects, so not as logical in many cases.

Feel free to make suggestions for the two types of hacks! (It's best if anyone who wants to do this should start a new thread in the Ideas board that everyone can contribute to.)
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Sherlockkat

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #48 on: April 09, 2016, 07:10:22 PM »

How about a trojan which lets repair units repair parts for which we have schematics for? That gives us more incentive to use scanalyzers.

edit: Though, this could be a feature of repair units in general now that I think about it.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2016, 07:12:31 PM by Sherlockkat »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]
« Reply #49 on: April 09, 2016, 07:19:20 PM »

That sounds interesting, I hadn't thought of adding Trojans that enhance a machine's regular functionality like that. By this you mean even Repair Stations that aren't a high enough rating? My current thought about the Stations is to actually change them so that any of them can repair anything, it would just be a matter of time. (And perhaps having the schematic could reduce that time requirement, a nice bonus.)

Note: Scanalyzer functionality isn't finalized--same with some other machines--which makes it kinda hard to give the best suggestions :P. There will be more incentives to come.
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