Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Tone]

The full trajectory path of a guided weapon can be much further than the weapon's range.  A guided weapon's total path distance for setting waypoints is restricted to its range, but the projectile will continue to travel beyond that path until it is interrupted or hits the "boundary" which is a circle centered on Cogmind with a radius equal to the weapon range.  This creates some interesting possibilities for firing guided weapons a long distance around corners, walls, or other obstacles.

To recreate:  Fire a guided weapon and set the waypoint one tile short of its max range, then for the second direction select the tile one space back in the opposite direction.  The projectile will reach it's "max range", turn around, travel it's "range" again as it passes Cogmind, and continue past until it reaches its "max range" in the opposite direction -- which results with a total projectile travel distance of approximately three-times the weapon's range.

This may be intended behavior (or even a bug-turned-feature ), but it is unexpected and not very intuitive so I've decided to submit it.

[Kyzrati]

I did see mention of this stuff on Discord (wizard mode giving me more bugs xD--this is one reason I hadn't wanted it out there too early!).

I don't recall whether this was intended or not, I think it actually might've been to avoid cheese and/or tedium. For example one could theoretically run out the range intentionally and detonate at a specific point.

Though in either case, I'm not sure there's a good solution for it given the architecture. I'll have to look at it, though I'm on the fence about this, partially because it's been this way forever, and the only way anyone even knows about it is due to the freedom of wizard mode

[Valguris]

Though in either case, I'm not sure there's a good solution for it given the architecture. I'll have to look at it, though I'm on the fence about this, partially because it's been this way forever, and the only way anyone even knows about it is due to the freedom of wizard mode

Actually I didn't report it, since I thought I already did it ages ago. Whoops. And I was mistaken in what the current behaviour is, anyway; I thought it travels full weapon's range distance after the last waypoint.

I think it actually might've been to avoid cheese and/or tedium. For example one could theoretically run out the range intentionally and detonate at a specific point.

This is precisely what I've been trying to do. Instead, I have learned to just target a nearby wall or make a path that visits more (centers of) tiles where I suspect an opponent is.

Maybe guided explosives could be allowed to explode at an empty tile, if that tile was targeted? Or you can spend a waypoint to explode the projectile at a given spot. That way there is no tedium.

I'd also like some indicator of how far I can target since the last waypoint (only relevant if current behaviour is changed), e.g. remaining range mentioned in the "volley window".

[Kyzrati]

Maybe guided explosives could be allowed to explode at an empty tile, if that tile was targeted? Or you can spend a waypoint to explode the projectile at a given spot. That way there is no tedium.

This is an interesting alternative behavior, to have them always explode at the last waypoint. Though it would mean you couldn't fire well around corners and/or into unknown areas, which would kinda suck. So I guess not...

I'd also like some indicator of how far I can target since the last waypoint (only relevant if current behaviour is changed), e.g. remaining range mentioned in the "volley window".

Yeah I've had problems with guided ranges in the past. It's actually not super intuitive in how it's calculated, IIRC.

[Valguris]

Maybe guided explosives could be allowed to explode at an empty tile, if that tile was targeted? Or you can spend a waypoint to explode the projectile at a given spot. That way there is no tedium.

This is an interesting alternative behavior, to have them always explode at the last waypoint. Though it would mean you couldn't fire well around corners and/or into unknown areas, which would kinda suck. So I guess not...

Huh, what do you mean? I think you could still put the last waypoint in the fog of war? At max range, if that is your wish.

[Kyzrati]

Ah right, I'd forgotten you can set waypoints outside FOV, a feature that was added later. (I actually pretty much never use guided weapons myself xD)

The guided situation overall gets rather complicated, since we also have non-AOE guided weapons to consider, and sometimes you might want your projectile to keep heading in its last direction until it hits "something." I don't see a perfect solution that also keeps the UI simple...

[Decker]

I'm firing a guided weapon with one waypoint set. As I move the cursor, the AOE indicator disappears. I infer the weapon is now out-of-range as with any other weapon. I move the cursor back one tile. The AOE indicator reappears. The weapon is still out-of-range. This is an inconsistency in the UI.

[Kyzrati]

Yep, guided weapons don't behave properly in terms of range at the edges of their range once you are using waypoints. This has been a known issue for a few years (not really easy to solve this one given its complexity and intersection with other pieces of the architecture), merging your post with the existing thread on this topic (was just a couple posts down from yours in this board ).

[Decker]

OK, I wasn't sure it was the same bug. Can't you use the same code for displaying the AOE that you use for computing the weapon range? Perhaps as special case for guided weapon.

[Kyzrati]

I'm sure there's solutions in there, this particular topic is just super low priority due to its complexity vs relative importance.

[Kyzrati]

For Beta 13 I've gone ahead and added projectile cumulative range tracking, so guided weapons will obey their actual travel range, for better or worse.



Needed to do this now because it'll also be relevant with the upcoming projectile deflection mechanics... It still wasn't absolutely necessary, but it's been in my notes forever so we'll at least see how this plays out.