Alpha 7/7b Discussions [SPOILER VERSION]

[Sherlockkat]

That sounds interesting, I hadn't thought of adding Trojans that enhance a machine's regular functionality like that. By this you mean even Repair Stations that aren't a high enough rating?

Yep. That's exactly what I mean. The low level repair units are pretty cool and useful early in the game. I don't use the high level machines all that much. I have had hacks fail on them (esp garrisons) when I have had +70pc from hacking gear. Toss in the fact that you are on the clock on higher floors and don't want to get traced, the high level machines are a lot less desirable to play around with. So, being able to buff up the lower level machines with trojans might be interesting.

[Kyzrati]

Ah, okay, but in this case that won't really be necessary since all stations will probably be able to repair anything. The advantage of using higher-rated stations will be a faster repair time. But allowing it to be even faster with a Trojan might work, although it would also need to be balanced against the fact that you could then theoretically turn a low-rated station into a high-rated station.

[Enno]

ok thanks for this answer, save a lot of time ..
because i tried a lot of hacks and none with succsess

i would like when we could use all other machines than the terminals
for a botnet too.

...and i have my own little cogmind-hack-wiki with 14 unauthorized hacks in it.

[Kyzrati]

i would like when we could use all other machines than the terminals
for a botnet too.

That would be a little OP . There are already plenty of terminals out there, and there are diminishing returns on botnets, anyway. More importantly, from a design perspective the idea is that by choosing to add a terminal to your botnet, you might fail and have to forgo other hacking opportunities there, so it's a trade off. I did think of a couple new non-terminal Trojans yesterday that I'll see about adding soon, though.

I also noticed Qbert911 has recently put a new section about these hacks on the wiki . It's incomplete, though I know a few players are familiar with more of the hacks, having seen me do them before.

[Enno]

ok. my idea was to install botnet-trojans into other machines than
terminals to have more chances to hack for more important things at the terminals.
with a huge botnet in background. especially for the levels -7 and up.
my biggest botnet was linked with 5 terminals and this was luck imo.
of course there are plenty terminals outhere but in the upper level
im happy if a hack works anyway^^

the new wiki-section is what the cogmind-wiki has needed.
i have some more hacks are missing there but im unsure to add.

and i dont like the name for the section..top 10 hacks...
"hacks they don't want you to know about!" seems to be entirely sufficient.
because now there are more than 10, i have 15 now...and the future will also brings more.

[Kyzrati]

Botnets don't give you much of a benefit past the first few, anyway, so not really worth making them so large. If you want other help, assimilate an Operator

and i dont like the name for the section..top 10 hacks...
"hacks they don't want you to know about!" seems to be entirely sufficient.
because now there are more than 10, i have 15 now...and the future will also brings more.

Haha, you can take up the obviously sensational approach with the author. I didn't write it

And yeah you can ruin it by adding more!

[Qbert911]

I updated the link on the main wiki page as per Enno's suggestion (as the number 10 was misleading, even if funny).

I enjoy updating the wiki and would appreciate being told about any unauthorized hacks not presently listed. (hint, hint)

[Happylisk]

Thanks for working on the wiki!  I always mean to but I'm so lazy.  I have a bunch of lore screenshots I really should upload...

[Kyzrati]

Thanks Qbert911!

Certainly guides and helpful tips like that are the best kinds of things to add at this point, since specific content like items, robots, and machines are subject to change (although less and less so as time goes on).

[Sherlockkat]

My first alpha 7 win:

The run was super smooth until -2 wrecked me. I had already hacked the exit in -2, but got caught in a series of stasis traps with hunters and grunts for company. It was clear that I was going to lose most of my equipment, so I did the sensible thing and stuffed my good prototype flight equipment into the inventory for later use in access. I then spent rest of my time in -2 hunting for a good power supply mostly naked except for a few processors which survived everything. I ne'er managed to lose those hunters and the swarmers that joined the party later. But, you have a such deep health pool by the time you hit -2 that you can just explore while taking damage as long as you know where the exit is. Finally, found a quantum reactor and beelined to the exit with about 40% of my core left!!

-1 wasn't bad. RNG was merciful. I didn't find any good equipment. But I found an energy cycler and the exit soon after. Spent some time looking for a weapon to blow through the shell and found a micro-nuke. By the way, the micro-nuke launcher does zero damage to the reinforced walls guarded by those behemoths. I would have won a previous run if I that would have worked.

 Score/15141

Cogmind - Alpha 7b

Name: Sherlockkat

---[ ESCAPED! ]---

Performance
-------------
Evolutions (9)             4500
Robots Destroyed (31)      155
Value Destroyed (654)      654
Prototype IDs (          160
Alien Tech Identified (0)  0
Bonus (9672)               9672
              TOTAL SCORE: 15141

Cogmind
---------
Core Integrity             1520/1600
Matter                     33/300
Energy                     300/300
System Corruption          4%
Temperature                Cool (0)
Location                   Surface

Parts
-------
Power (3)
  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion (5)
  High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
  Experimental Q-Thruster
  Electron Diverter
Utility (15)
  Improved System Shield
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  System Shield
  Experimental Core Analyzer
Weapon (2)
  Micro-nuke Launcher

Inventory
-----------
Improved Arc Projector
Advanced Weight Redist. System

Peak State
------------
Power
  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion
  High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
  Xenon Bombardment Thruster
  Electron Diverter
  Experimental Q-Thruster
Utility
  Improved System Shield
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  System Shield
  Experimental Core Analyzer
Weapon
  Enhanced Quantum Rifle
[Rating: 87]

Favorites
-----------
Power                      Light Deuterium Engine
  Engine                   Light Deuterium Engine
  Reactor                  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion                 Flight Unit
  Treads                   High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
  Leg                      Aluminum Leg
  Flight Unit              Flight Unit
Utility                    Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  Device                   Advanced Terrain Scanner
  Processor                Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  Hackware                 System Shield
Weapon                     Lightning Gun
  Energy Gun               Lightning Gun
  Energy Cannon            Heavy Plasma Cannon
  Ballistic Gun            Light Assault Rifle
  Ballistic Cannon         Graviton Cannon
  Launcher                 Mini Grenade Launcher
  Impact Weapon            Maul
  Special Melee Weapon     Improved Datajack

Stats
-------
Bonus Breakdown            9672
  Win                      3000
  Fast Win                 6672
Classes Destroyed          7
  Worker                   2
  Builder                  1
  Hauler                   1
  Recycler                 1
  Operator                 4
  Watcher                  2
  Swarmer                  20
NPCs Destroyed             0
Best Kill Streak           8
  Combat Bots Only         6
Matter Collected           877
  Salvage Created          647
Parts Attached             90
  Power                    12
  Propulsion               31
  Utility                  22
  Weapon                   25
Parts Lost                 34
  Power                    4
  Propulsion               15
  Utility                  9
  Weapon                   6
Average Slot Usage (%)     71
  Naked Turns              2
Spaces Moved               4768
  Fastest Speed (%)        500
  Average Speed (%)        335
  Slowest Speed (%)        50
  Overloaded Moves         0
  Propulsion Burnouts      0
  Targets Rammed           2
  Cave-ins Triggered       0
  Teleports                0
Heaviest Build             33
  Greatest Overweight (x)  6
  Average Overweight (x)   0
Largest Inventory          4
  Most Items Carried       4
  Average Items Carried    3
Core Damage Taken          1163
Average Core Remaining (%) 88
  Depth 10 Exit            84
  Depth 9 Exit             91
  Depth 8 Exit             82
  Depth 7 Exit             97
  Depth 6 Exit             100
  Depth 5 Exit             100
  Depth 4 Exit             100
  Depth 3 Exit             100
  Depth 2 Exit             38
  Depth 1 Exit             95
Volleys Fired              57
  Largest                  2
  Hottest                  94
Shots Fired                76
  Gun                      56
  Cannon                   4
  Launcher                 16
  Special                  0
  Kinetic                  27
  Thermal                  10
  Explosive                16
  Electromagnetic          23
Shots Hit Robots           39
  Core Hits                49
Overload Shots             0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Heat Surge               0
  Short Circuit            0
  Meltdown                 0
Melee Attacks              15
  Impact                   10
  Slashing                 0
  Piercing                 0
Damage Inflicted           1961
  Projectiles              542
  Explosions               1171
  Melee                    233
  Ramming                  15
  Kinetic                  167
  Thermal                  102
  Explosive                1130
  Electromagnetic          314
  Impact                   233
  Slashing                 0
  Piercing                 0
Self-Inflicted Damage      167
  Shots                    4
  Rammed                   2
Highest Temperature        168
  Average Temperature      31
  Shutdowns                0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Interference             0
  Matter Decay             0
  Short Circuit            0
  Damage (minor)           0
  Damage (major)           0
  Damage (core)            0
Highest Corruption         4
  Average Corruption       3
  Message Errors           2
  Parts Rejected           1
  Data loss (map)          0
  Data loss (database)     2
  Misfires                 1
  Misdirections            2
  Targeting Errors         0
  Weapon Failures          0
  Depth 2 End              2
  Depth 1 End              4
Haulers Intercepted        1
Robots Corrupted           0
Robots Melted              0
Power Chain Reactions      0
Tactical Retreats          22
Communications Jammed      0
Parts Field Recycled       0
  Retrieved Matter         0
Parts Merge Repaired       0
Drone Launches             4
  Drone Recoveries         0
Derelicts Assembled        0
Traps Triggered            0
  Indirectly               0
Trap Hack Attempts         0
  Triggered                0
  Disarmed                 0
  Reprogrammed             0
  Reused                   0
Data Cores Recovered       1
  Used                     0
Machines Hacked            27
  Terminals                20
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          2
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          5
Total Hacks                69
  Successful               18
  Failed                   51
  Catastrophic             16
  Database Lockouts        0
  Manual                   22
  Unauthorized             52
  Terminals                58
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          3
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          8
Terminal Hacks             13
  Record                   0
  Part Schematic           0
  Robot Schematic          0
  Robot Analysis           0
  Prototype ID Bank        0
  Open Door                0
  Level Access Points      4
  Branch Access Points     0
  Emergency Access Points  0
  Machine Index            0
  Terminal Index           2
  Fabricator Index         0
  Repair Station Index     0
  Recycling Unit Index     0
  Scanalyzer Index         0
  Garrison Index           0
  Alert Level              1
  Unreport Threat          1
  Locate Traps             2
  Disarm Traps             0
  Reprogram Traps          0
  Dispatch Records         0
  Maintenance Status       0
  Security Status          0
  Surveillance Status      0
  Patrol Status            0
  Transport Status         0
  Investigation Status     0
  Extermination Status     0
  Reinforcement Status     0
  Assault Status           0
  Garrison Status          0
  Intercept Status         0
  Recall Investigation     0
  Recall Extermination     0
  Recall Reinforcements    0
  Recall Assault           0
  Hauler Manifests         0
  Registered Components    2
  Registered Prototypes    0
  Zone Layout              0
  Sector Layout            0
  Machine Controls         1
Hacking Detections         21
  Full Trace Events        3
  Feedback Events          0
  Feedback Corruption      0
  Feedback Part Disabled   0
  Feedback Blocked         0
Trojans Installed          1
  Terminals                1
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          0
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          0
Fabricators Overloaded     0
Garrisons Disabled         3
Garrisons Compromised      0
Robot Schematics Acquired  0
  Robots Built             0
  Total Robot Build Rating 0
  Robot Fabrication Matter 0
  Robot Fabrication Time   0
Part Schematics Acquired   0
  Parts Built              0
  Total Part Build Rating  0
  Part Fabrication Matter  0
  Part Fabrication Time    0
Parts Repaired             0
  Part Repair Time         0
Parts Recycled             0
  Recycled Matter          0
  Retrieved Matter         0
  Retrieved Components     0
Parts Scanalyzed           0
  Part Schematics Acquired 0
  Parts Damaged            0
Robot Analysis Total       0
Robots Rewired             0
Robots Hacked              0
  Non-combat               1
  Combat                   0
  Parse                    0
  Link                     0
  Rebooted                 0
  Overloaded               1
  Assimilated              0
  Manual                   0
  Secondary                0
Robot Hack Failures        1
Allies Hacked              0
Hacks Repelled             0
Total Allies               4
  Largest Group            2
  Highest-Rated Group      76
  Highest-Rated Ally       38
Total Orders               4
  STAY                     0
  GOTO                     0
  ROAM                     1
  FOLLOW                   0
  GUARD                    0
  AID                      0
  BUILD                    0
  TUNNEL                   0
  DROP                     0
  PICKUP                   0
  COLLECT                  0
  EXPLORE                  3
  RETURN                   0
Terraforming Orders        0
  Walls Built              0
  Walls Tunneled           0
Ally Attacks               0
  Total Damage             0
  Kills                    0
Allies Corrupted           0
Allies Melted              0
Peak Influence             145
  Average Influence        25
  Final Influence          50
Maximum Alert Level        0
  Low Security (%)         100
  Level 1                  0
  Level 2                  0
  Level 3                  0
  Level 4                  0
  Level 5                  0
Squads Dispatched          12
  Investigation            4
  Extermination            2
  Reinforcement            6
  Assault                  0
  Garrison                 0
  Intercept                0
Derelict Logs Recovered    0
Exploration Rate (%)       20
  Regions Visited          11
  Pre-discovered Areas     0
Garrisons Visited          0
  Relays Disabled          0
  Generators Disabled      0
Network Hubs Disabled      0
Turns Passed               2775
  Depth 11                 50
  Depth 10                 266
  Depth 9                  126
  Depth 8                  170
  Depth 7                  356
  Depth 6                  195
  Depth 5                  187
  Depth 4                  503
  Depth 3                  320
  Depth 2                  304
  Depth 1                  298
  Scrapyard                50
  Materials                562
  Factory                  1241
  Research                 624
  Access                   298
                           0

Prototype IDs
---------------
High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
Improved Flight Unit
Improved Cesium-ion Thruster
Improved Nuclear Pulse Thruster
Electron Diverter
Experimental Q-Thruster
Graviton Cannon
Experimental Core Analyzer

Alien Tech Recovered
----------------------
None

Route
-------
-11/Scrapyard
-10/Materials
-9/Materials
-8/Materials
-7/Factory
-6/Factory
-5/Factory
-4/Factory
-3/Research
-2/Research
-1/Access
Surface

Game
------
Seed: 1460661737
^Manual?: 0
Play Time: 55 min
Sessions: 3
Mod: N/A
Game No.: 211
ASCII: 1
Keyboard: 1
Movement: Numpad
Fullscreen: 1
Font: 12/Tallcaps
Map View: 83x54


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4495511911919469

[close]

I think I have hit upon a decent stealth setup which lets me clear research more or less consistently:

i) Decent propulsion: Speed of 25~35. Flight is the best. Jumping over civilian bots is very useful for losing enemies in tight corridors. You outrun all the walking/hovering robots anyway. The only trouble comes from swarmers. I avoid them like the plague.

ii) Decent hackware: anywhere between +40 to +60 to hacks seems good. System shields are nice but not critical. My favorite hacks are Access(Main), Garrison seals, Index(Terminals), Inventory(Components), Manifests and Trojan(Track). Hacking is my primary means for getting ahead of the food clock. Garrison seals delays programmer dispatch and access(main) obviously cuts down pointless exploration and getting into trouble. I rarely see programmer dispatches. I think I saw two in this game and I was gone before they found me.

iii) Semi-decent sensor setup : Optical arrays lets me see far and sensor arrays let me see around corners. That's more or less all I need to avoid immediate trouble.

iv) A mid-game thermal cannon: lets me burrow through walls with no matter cost. This has saved my ass more than once. You can get a sense of the local level layout by watching civilian traffic and figure out which walls to blow through. I have avoided some major thoroughfares in research via this method. Lot less messier than launchers.

v) A decent launcher: More of a security blanket, useful to deal with swarmers. I avoid using it as much as possible.

vi) An optional melee weapon in case you need matter.

The general plan is hack the exit, beeline to it and pick up stuff on the way. Works like a charm. More or less.

[Decker]

Congrats for your win, Sherlockkat!

I agree that having a thermal cannon is very useful. It's sometimes hard to find the nova cannon you need to punch through the walls in Research, though, so having launchers handy is still useful.

[Kyzrati]

Wow, another Alpha 7 victory, and a really fast one!

Spent some time looking for a weapon to blow through the shell and found a micro-nuke. By the way, the micro-nuke launcher does zero damage to the reinforced walls guarded by those behemoths. I would have won a previous run if I that would have worked.

That's right, those are blast doors. If you have a Structural Scanner you can get the full analysis on them and see that they are incredibly reinforced against EX damage. The easiest way to get through is either with a powerful TH cannon, or simply crit your way through it with any regular guns/cannons. Most melee weapons can also bring it down.

The only trouble comes from swarmers. I avoid them like the plague.

The S-43 variant has a fitting name, don't you think?

iv) A mid-game thermal cannon: lets me burrow through walls with no matter cost. This has saved my ass more than once. You can get a sense of the local level layout by watching civilian traffic and figure out which walls to blow through. I have avoided some major thoroughfares in research via this method. Lot less messier than launchers.

Good tactic. I should do that more often. I do it occasionally, but don't usually have sensors, and end up in those thoroughfares, pull out the launcher, and oh man it gets tough from there as more patrols show up

(This is with a combat build, though...)

It's sometimes hard to find the nova cannon you need to punch through the walls in Research, though, so having launchers handy is still useful.

That's the kind of thing a friendlier fabrication system will be able to fix. It might make things too easy for experts who always know exactly what they want, but we'll see...

[Sherlockkat]

Congrats for your win, Sherlockkat!

Thank you . I have got the hang of speed runs, I think. Gonna switch it up to combat builds and try to win those now. Speed is so much fun and faster to play though. It took me 55 mins to escape. I can barely make it to research in that time if I am playing combat. And about 15 mins to die after that.

Spent some time looking for a weapon to blow through the shell and found a micro-nuke. By the way, the micro-nuke launcher does zero damage to the reinforced walls guarded by those behemoths. I would have won a previous run if I that would have worked.

That's right, those are blast doors. If you have a Structural Scanner you can get the full analysis on them and see that they are incredibly reinforced against EX damage. The easiest way to get through is either with a powerful TH cannon, or simply crit your way through it with any regular guns/cannons. Most melee weapons can also bring it down.

Yup. It sucked. .

It's sometimes hard to find the nova cannon you need to punch through the walls in Research, though, so having launchers handy is still useful.

That's the kind of thing a friendlier fabrication system will be able to fix. It might make things too easy for experts who always know exactly what they want, but we'll see...

Do you need a nova cannon? I have punched my way through research walls with hvy plasma cannons, hvy neutron cannons and neutron cannons, all of which you can find in factory.

[Kyzrati]

It's sometimes hard to find the nova cannon you need to punch through the walls in Research, though, so having launchers handy is still useful.

That's the kind of thing a friendlier fabrication system will be able to fix. It might make things too easy for experts who always know exactly what they want, but we'll see...

Do you need a nova cannon? I have punched my way through research walls with hvy plasma cannons, hvy neutron cannons and neutron cannons, all of which you can find in factory.

Nope. You can easily get through Research walls even with mid-tier cannons. Maybe Decker is obsessed with heavy firepower guaranteed to melt anything instantly?